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mick

Worsley Dale Garden Railway

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Hi Mick, yeah I will be still plodding along slowly till the weather stats to get cooler, this week has been very nice, not hot but still the humidity is high, still recovering from Saturday election polling day.

Looks like I made the right move going module in the outdoor layout then, taking longer to build, I will be leaving posts in the garden once they are level, can't wait to run the first train even if it is on the Tehachapi loop section to the station.

This weekend isn't going to be a hot one, be able to finish the module before the station platforms, Mick what do they call the track leading into a station platform and leaving, was a discussion at the train club yesterday, no one seamed to know .

Ran my duel tender drive Flying Scot and she ran really well, except for parcel van derailing, must be the bogies and couplers causing the problem, did a 8 minute video clip and when I was modifying it I stuffed it by deleting some of the video, oh well will have to wait till next time, hopping the video is in the galley of the app on the phone.

Sad to hear Ron is demolishing his layout, still a few of us from Down under with outdoor layouts and when Roy sorts out an indoor layout, be great to see more pics from Worsley Dale and waiting for dry weather.

Doublecee are you building a new garden railway.

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I think there is a trend in how us garden railway people work on layouts. A lot of the excitement happens when we are in the early building stages. Things tend to taper off once layouts get done, or nearly done. Also, if it's your first garden railway the enthusiasm is a new experience.

I sympathize with your weather issues. We've been having a couple days of beautiful weather followed by snow. Today is yet another snow day. Tomorrow should be in the 50's though.

Seems like everyone is hunkered down waiting for the spring weather to come. :)

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It's so good to see the sun out, plants beginning to grow, and the temperatures gradually rising again. Worsley Dale has experienced another bad spell, we've been to 3 funerals already this year, but we've come through and are starting to move forward again.

The layout remains as it was last year but there are a couple of problems that will need sorting out. Firstly, the last time I powered up the track I experienced a short circuit and it was so cold that I didn't have the enthusiasm to work out what was causing the problem. Locating a short when the whole layout comprises one continuous circuit isn't easy (food for thought next time perhaps?) but I'm sure I'll find the problem. Secondly, there's one short section of felt that has rippled, and raised a small section of track. It's only a few inches in length and by good fortune it's alongside a rail join that doesn't have any wires soldered to it so shouldn't be too much of a problem to put right.

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Hi Mick, deepest sympathy goes out to you and your family the loss in your family, Tony from down under. Know what you must be going through, we have to face a funereal in the next few years our self, son has a terminal illness, he is 28 now and lucky to sill to be here suffers with MD, 24/7 care.

Yeah wiring can be a pain with it short circuits, ok if you have the wires colour coded and a plan of the wiring, what I would like to do is wire in a bulb on each block and if there is a short circuit the bulb will light up, my train club has that set up, the very cold winter you could of being the cause of the problem and a wire snapped maybe .

A lot of us are having some issues with their outdoor layout, I wounder if the bigger scales suffer the same, a set with mine as well, have to cut back and looks like the Tehachapi loop will be scrapped and done another spiral in the new design, not giving up moving along train running earlier.

Just realised that when typing I am not hitting the key hard enough till after the post has been posted, thanks to edit the error can be fixed even though I check the post before sending

Tony

Edited by Guest

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Good idea on planning for potential electrical problems. Perhaps it's worth it to cut the mains into blocks on both rails and then use some screw type connectors for easy disconnection.

I keep looking at my own layout and wondering if I should be analog or digital. Maybe it's time to wire it for analog and just swap out the transformer for digital when I want to run digital, but it would allow for having isolated blocks for testing.

Been a rough month for us here with temps in the teens. Was 12 last night. I look forward to spring. :) I also look forward to your garden updates Mick.

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Still no further forward but at least I've had chance to do a bit of work alongside the railway and remedy(?) a nagging fault.

Firstly the short circuit I was experiencing. I have located the problem as being one of my frog juicer's - I guess the winter weather has got to it. I know I really ought to have disconnected them and brought them indoors at the end of last summer in readiness for the winter break but I had other things on my mind at that time and it all got overlooked. Noted for the future.

The borders alongside the two viaducts have had some attention over recent weeks. The new viaduct now has some plants for company and being fast growing it shouldn't take long for the bare earth to be covered by Aubretia. I chose that as a change from the Thyme found elsewhere along the railway's edge.

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The older viaduct now has a covering of small stone around its arches along with one or two plants. I'm hoping it wont be too long before the stone weathers and becomes home to some moss or other greenery.

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And lastly, a photograph of two additions to the loco fleet - these being the Rail Exclusive 'Vi-Trains' Northern Belle class 47s. This pair are both fitted with DCC sound chips and once I'd got the short circuit sorted out I was able to give them a short run between the viaducts. The sound fills the garden nicely!

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One or two areas of existing trackwork will need some attention but luckily there's nothing too serious and hopefully I will be able to get the remainder of the layout completed before I have to think about replacing the wooden sections with some kind of permanent masonry base. It's not surprising that I'm just a bit wary of increasing the throttle when there's a pair of loco's costing more than £400 trundling round. I feel more at ease with a nice gentle pace until I've had chance to do some more running and my confidence returns.

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Hi Mick just pure awesome, you sure have being busy in the land scapping department, your layout does match the English country side especially the viaducts, I love the choose of the coloured gravel as well, we have coloured gravel but it is very expensive and only comes in small bags.

Yeah I would have the same feeling as well with the 47class locos and colour scheme nice, very surprised two locos with the same name Northern Bell is that quite common in England,, close to $800 over here, be awesome to here the diesel sound on a video clip, do you have the matching coaches too.

Have redesigned my layout the spiral is now in the pergola side garden and will run down one side of the house at this stage, will never be like your layout and land scaping be happy to just get trains running a bit sooner now, can't wait for the big moment.

Hope to get the new air-con paid off pretty quickly way before my birthday and in between that need heaps of points, damn whipper snipper packed up today, no buying a petrol one going for a Ryobi 36volt whipper snipper as I am going to buy some time this year the Ryobi 36volt 18inch mower and need a hedge trimmer as well, never ending, keep the great work up.

Oh yeah I posted two pics the same in my gallery again too scared to hit that delete button, last time I deleted all the pics in my gallery luckily there were only a few to many now,can you do it, thanks.

Happy modelling, Tony

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aussietmrail said:

...very surprised two locos with the same name Northern Bell is that quite common in England,, close to $800 over here, be awesome to here the diesel sound on a video clip, do you have the matching coaches too....

I don't have any plans to get the matching coaches at this time but you never know ;) . I did consider it but ultimately decided I have too many coaches anyway and so I'll use this pair simply as 'visitors' for the time being. I believe Chris has a full rake of coaches along with the Hornby versions of the Northern Belle loco's on his Amblethorpe layout.

I've just ordered a replacement frog juicer for the one I appear to have ruined so that I can get my points back in working order. Might have a look at giving them better protection this time to avoid losing any more. I don't suppose there's any necessity to have the electronic boards right adjacent to the point - maybe I could house them better indoors or in a removable panel and just run some wires alongside the track. Each point would only need 3 wires if I remember correctly. Something to look into.

aussietmrail said:

..Oh yeah I posted two pics the same in my gallery again too scared to hit that delete button, last time I deleted all the pics in my gallery luckily there were only a few to many now,can you do it, thanks...

No problem. I'll look into that for you.

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Good news and bad news. The good news is that I took advantage of the lovely weather to sort out that bit of trackwork where the roofing felt appeared to have rippled. I even managed to do it without lifting any track. The bad news is that I discovered it wasn't just the roofing felt that had rippled but that the plywood base had also begun to delaminate. I've effected a temporary repair by driving in a couple of screws to bring the laminations together again but I'm aware that's not going to last long. Some bitumen along the repaired section of felt should help keep out any rain for a short time until I can decide what to do next.

I've realised for a while now that timber close to the ground isn't the best idea. I keep looking at my viaducts and seeing just how well they stand up to whatever the weather throws at them, especially after having a plywood viaduct on the Selby layout. I want to feel the same confidence with the whole layout as I currently have with the viaducts. I've been foolish and really should have known better but there you go. Hopefully I'll be able to keep things running back and forth whilst I make any necessary changes and at the same time continue to progress with the rest of the layout.

So I need a weatherproof base for the track and one that's going to be easy to install on top of the blockwork and concrete foundations that are already in place. There's not going to be any further earthworks so I'm looking for something that will simply replace the exterior plywood layer. I need to know more about 'rubbercrete' and its application. I've also wondered whether rubber 'play area' tiles might work? Might I instead, be better adding a masonry layer? I just want to see the rain coming down, snow and ice on the ground, and know that whatever I decide to use it will withstand it all.

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Mick,

Have you thought about cutting slices of the same blocks you built the viaduct with these could be cemented to the foundations and the track fixed in the same way as the viaduct section.....already haveing the foundations is a mixed blessing but it may be worth a trial? I think I'm going to attempt to use.the blocks.as both foundation and track bed for my line but until I start groundwork it's all still a bit "up in the air"!

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Hi Mick, everyone is having the same issue, I wonder if the O gauge blokes have the same problem with their base boards , like what has happened with yours.

I am glad I have gone module set up with my layout wont have that issue, layout will be easy to set up, all wiring will be plug and play may leave it up for a couple of days to run trains, every module sections will coded same as the bridges as well.

Quote

I've realised for a while now that timber close to the ground isn't the best idea. I keep looking at my viaducts and seeing just how well they stand up to whatever the weather throws at them, especially after having a plywood viaduct on the Selby layout. I want to feel the same confidence with the whole layout as I currently have with the viaducts. I've been foolish and really should have known better but there you go. Hopefully I'll be able to keep things running back and forth whilst I make any necessary changes and at the same time continue to progress with the rest of the layout.

Have you heard of rubber Crete, fungus has used it as a track bed on his layout, saw it mentioned in a new blokes post Trevor his name is, they use old threaded tyres now and the beauty is you can nail in the track nails straight to it.

Thanks for deleting that second Elizabeth river bridge NT pic, that bridge will be going on my layout, my brother in law was head engineer on all the bridges on the new rail line between Alice Spring and Darwin was opened in 2004, have the two Ghan NR class locos, he will have the duty in driving my train across the bridge.

Happy modelling Tony.

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And then there's uPVC, the stuff they use for soffits and fascias.

I think it's available in 9 and 16mm thicknesses and it's not all that expensive, well at least it isn't at a specialist warehouse in Castleford.

I haven't used it on the layout myself but if I'd thought about it at the time of building the layout I may have given it a try.

I think I'm about due for a visit too Mick. :)

Ian.

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It's the ongoing problem with outdoor railways (The Warps).

I don't think anyone has come up with a solution.

My last piece of chipboard/laminated wood went into place in September 2013 (see page 22 of Rossi railway in the sun). It has now warped at both ends due to water retention and then the fierce sunshine drying it out. As I said at the time, I knew it would need replacing after a year or so and so it has proven.

Then September last year 2014,(seems I do a lot of work in that particular month!) I ventured into laying breeze type blocks along the front. This has been very successful. (Page 27). No derailments and only the odd piece of track lifting slightly. I rectify this with the odd blob of Super Glue.

This got me to thinking about modellers who are building track at ground level. Maybe a channel dug out and filled with concrete, i.e. the start of a mini pathway. Then breeze blocks cut and laid in place on top. With the aid of a spirit level and whilst the cement is still soft you could build up a nice (and realistic) permanent track way. In theory.

Maybe one of our newer members who are venturing from the planning stage to reality could give it a go.

My days of chipboard/wood decking are finally behind me, even though at first, that piece of ultra smooth wood looks inviting!

Now...In our garden centre I have come across a new product which is used for decking. I can't remember the name but it is made from some sort of reinforced heavy duty plastic and looks very durable. I'm thinking of trying this out across the girder bridges to replace the metre and a half wooden section.

Updates and pixs will follow in time.

Maybe it will maybe it wont, but God loves a trier.

More transformations in the house and clear-outs, as well as book dead-lines, so not sure when this will happen...But it will!!!

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As I recall even Fungus who does masonry throughout had a tree root lift some of his mainline. As you say Rossi, it's all part of the game.

Mick, the layout is looking very nice. I expect those plants will really fill out and give it a natural look.

Really like those new locos. I expect we'll see them pulling something entirely realistic like a string a mineral wagons. he he

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I am also looking for a solution to this problem, already having the ground level base, partly concrete and partly brick, skimmed with mortar. It originally had 1/2 inch pieces of hardwood set into the skim, for pinning the track to but this has now rotted. I laid some Rolson Interlocking Cushioned Floor Mat pieces, cut to the proposed track plan as this would take track pins and is not harmed by water. This has been outside for over 12 months to test it and seems to have shrunk a bit and started curling at the edges. There are probably expansion and contraction issues with changes in temperature. Perhaps I should have tried to glue it to the masonry with SBR adhesive or Gorilla Glue.

I am now considering using Stokbord (Registered TM) which is available in 12mm and 9mm thicknesses and is made from recycled plastic. I think someone on this forum has already tried using this but I haven't heard how successful it is in the long term. It is available from agricultural suppliers for farmers to build stock partitions and pig sties, etc., and looks very durable. Careful planning would be needed when cutting it out, to make the most of an 8' x 4' piece.

Trevor Jones's Rubbercrete seems to be the most successful base but I don't know whether it would work as a thin layer on the top of existing masonry. Could it be installed in sections (spirit level length) with a batten at each end? If so, how thick would the batten need to be? Once it had set firmly I would remove the battens and infill with more Rubbercrete. I certainly don't intend trying to excavate the existing base to put in shuttering for a deeper thickness!

Anyone care to share their experiences of either of these suggestions?

Riddles

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Thanks to everyone for their input. Lots of ideas for me to mull over. I'm certainly not looking forward to replacing the entire section between the two viaducts (especially through the tunnel area) but I know I'm never going to settle until it's eventually done. However, as I've already said, it's not something I need to do right away. I think I've sorted the offending section and hopefully it will allow me some time to think of the best way forward. I'm sure it's ultimately going to involve mixing something with cement and the rubber granules sounds like it could be the best option for me. I'd prefer to avoid anything that needs gluing or screwing down as I think my patience is wearing a bit thin when it comes to cutting shapes out of sheet material. In my opinion it's best if you can avoid joins between sections of baseboard but remember, I'm talking track at ground level.

Riddles said:

...Trevor Jones's Rubbercrete seems to be the most successful base but I don't know whether it would work as a thin layer on the top of existing masonry. Could it be installed in sections (spirit level length) with a batten at each end?....

The batten/spirit level idea is the way I've been thinking. I'm not sure just how easy the finished mix can be worked once it has dried but I've heard that it can take some sanding which would be helpful.

Riddles said:

....I am now considering using Stokbord (Registered TM) which is available in 12mm and 9mm thicknesses and is made from recycled plastic....

I've used 'composite' decking for my patio area which is made from recycled plastic. I've also used some short sections of composite decking as an access cover above my tunnel area. The patio decking hasn't been a problem since I installed it but the short sections I've used for the tunnel access cover are continually in need of prising out and filing down due to expansion. Something to consider.

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Quote

the tunnel access cover are continually in need of prising out and filing down due to expansion. Something to consider.

The Stokbord Data Sheet gives the thermal expansion coefficient as 2.5mm per linear metre per 10 degrees Centigrade and recommends fitting at the highest temperature likely to be encountered. I think, although I could be wrong, that the expansion coefficient is somewhat higher than Peco Streamline Code 100 so this could be a problem.

Thanks for sharing that experience.

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I agree, expansion of plastics can be a problem.

On the subject of "rubbercrete", are rubber granules fairly easy to get hold of?

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I'm slightly confused by the term 'rubbercrete'. We appear to refer to it as a mix containing cement and rubber granules as the primary ingredients but it appears that 'rubbercrete' can also comprise rubber granules and an epoxy type resin binder. I think the epoxy resin mix is used for commercial applications such as childrens' play areas so I will assume that we will be talking about a mixture using cement as the binder.

IanR said:

...On the subject of "rubbercrete", are rubber granules fairly easy to get hold of?

As a source of rubber granules Fungus' blog points to the website of http://www.artificialgrass.org.uk/shop/rubber-granules/' rel="external nofollow">Verde Sports Limited and it seems they have a mix of granules (0.5 to 1.5mm in size) available in 25kg bags. I have no idea how far a 25kg bag would go.

I have been in touch with Trevor Jones regarding his 'rubbercrete' mix, which also includes cork granules, and he will be posting details to the forum soon.

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Rubbercrete does (in its original TJ recipe) contain cork granules. Ive bought this on EBay before (only in fairly small quantities) as fishermen use it, to make "boilies" (whatever they are :lol: )

My trackbed construction thread deals with rubbercrete, but if Trevor wants to give us a new thread on it, I will bow to his experience! :)

I, for one, will be using rubbercrete again(if I ever get a chance :x:roll: ) on any new railway I build - but this time I will construct with a little more finesse :lol::lol:

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