mick

You sure you 'aint be sniffing too much of that there bitumen adhesive... Nice progress Griff and what a lucky find! That lot would set me back goodness knows how much. What does the warning panel on the side of the tin warn against? It looks like 'dipping your head in bitumen'? By the way - when did you take up all your railway?

Yes I REALLY want ballast Roy. I want that authentic, realistic look and feel when I take photos or film videos. I know it's probably going to be more trouble than it's worth if things ever go wrong but if they do I'll probably chop a whole length of track out and renew it afresh. I don't mind a bit of maintenance should the need arise. I doubt there will ever be any large scale alterations to the track plan so it will just be maintenance. As for the adhesive, I'm using floor polish and so far it has set rock solid on top of the roofing felt. I'll have to see how it survives the English weather.

How do you know when you've done all you can and can safely move on to the next stage? That's the dilemma I'm in right now. I would like to complete the ballasting so that the sleepers are held in position and I've run a loco back and forth over the track a good number of times in order to highlight any track irregularities but when do I finally take the plunge and do it? Once the track is ballasted there's going to be little chance of easy alteration later if there is an annoying bump or twist and it's that fact which is holding me back. It isn't easy identifying all those bumps and twists using just one engine and I don't really have the room to accommodate a lengthy train yet. I wonder, should I just go for it and accept there may be something not absolutely perfect? The real world isn't perfect is it?

You've used a combination of the two methods Iain, a bonding wire across the join in addition to a power feed. I'm just using a power feed to each rail which in effect also acts as a bonding wire. This photo was taken this afternoon. There is a brown bus wire seen running down the right hand edge of the track base and the blue can just be seen running down the left side. For the sake of clarity, ignore the 3 pairs of blue and brown droppers which feed the left hand track. You're left with 2 pairs of black wires, one in the immediate foreground and one about 2 feet from the end of the line. Both these pairs of black wires straddle a rail join, in effect acting as a bonding wire, but instead of being fastened/soldered together as one single wire, they are connected directly to the power bus. In between these 2 pairs of wires is another rail join (approx mid way between the first 2 house bricks) but this doesn't need any wires or bonding wires adding, the 2 pairs of black wires mentioned at top and bottom of the photo supply power to all the sections of track. It's all down to personal choice and I only have experience of using bonding wires up to now so I can't say which is the better or most reliable method. I do feel the bus wire has advantages, one being that additional feeds can be taken from it easily. So long as the bus wire itself doesn't fail then it should be just fine.

Great scenery beyond the railway Andrew, especially the final 2 photos which certainly resemble the West Highland, but it won't wash down onto the tracks/board during a downpour will it? The ground does look rather dry - is it protected from the elements? I'd love a backdrop like that to my layout and it's something I've been trying hard to work out how to do it. You've got me thinking again. I have days myself where I manage only about a couple of metres of track or so but it means it's a couple of metres closer to completion. I've developed a bit more patience with this second attempt at building a layout.

That sounds like it could be good news. A severe gradient really is the last thing you want - you'd never be totally happy if it were preventing you from running the trains you wanted to run. You're lucky that you had a single block pillar that you could attempt to 'sink' and not a run of block walling that might have required the felt and wooden boards removing before major reconstruction. Fingers crossed.

I've just uploaded the following photo without realising it's similar to the one I posted yesterday and from what I can remember I don't think this part of the track has been touched since then so it's very much the same thing from the same viewpoint. However, whilst there is still work to be done on this section it does give a closer view of the track to show the on-going effects of the ballasting. With the ballast gradually being added the track bed is now starting to look like I'd hoped it would; the wooden sleeper track being especially pleasing. The concrete sleepers don't look right. The sleepers themselves appear too thin, or perhaps it's because they are too long that they just look thinner than they should. Still, I think once they've weathered they should be okay. It's good to see the larger picture and notice the real stone scattered about! Now it's down to the weather and to see if the polish can stand up to whatever is thrown it's way. While I was outside earlier I was looking at the track wiring where it connects to the bus wire. In the photographs I've uploaded showing the wiring to the track, I've commented on what at first seems to be a large number of wires. Only now have I realised that apart from the necessary 2 bus wires running down each side of the layout, wiring directly to a bus requires less wired connections to the track than bonding each individual rail joint does. When bonding a rail join you require 2 soldered connections, one to each side of the joint, using one single length of wire. If after making that connection you were to cut that wire at it's mid point and solder the 2 cut ends to a bus wire you can then miss out the next rail join completely. I think using a bus wire outdoors and connecting each section of track to it is certainly worthy of consideration.

I never even thought of anything like that - good job I didn't just decide to go ahead with exterior varnish then - especially after all my sleeper chopping! Would be great to sit there and watch them all melt away I have a tin of exterior varnish out in the shed so I'll check on the ingredients tomorrow just to be sure. The more I think about it the more I think we should run some extensive tests for suitable fixatives for exterior ballasting although I suspect that success is in part down to the application of the ballast and the fixative itself. Even the baseboard covering needs taking into account. There's probably not going to be one solution for all.

Keen to know if that gradient has sunk yet....???? Do you have to keep watering it?

You experienced the problems too then? You should see the cable thickness that I had recommend to me for the live steamers - I'm not sure I could have soldered it to the rails! Hope you have better luck now that you've separated the track into sections.

Hi Jason and welcome to the forum. As Ian has just said in his post, everyone has their own ideas about what's best for them and their particular situation but I think there are one or two things that few of us would disagree on. For track outdoors there's really only one choice at the moment and that's Peco Streamline code 100 with nickel silver rails. You have the choice of wooden or concrete sleepers depending on your preference. The nickel silver rails don't rust but they do tarnish after a time and the rail tops will require a quick clean with a very fine track rubber. It's proven for use outdoors (by people just like us) so nothing to worry about there unless you live somewhere with really extreme temperatures. Point are also okay outdoors provided you take a few precautions to keep them clean and free of debris. I think a little silicone grease/oil/lubricant on the spring is also recommended? In order to operate your Hornby collection 'as is' then you'll clearly be best running under standard DC control. Converting them all to DCC may be expensive and may give rise to some difficulties depending on the locos. I'm sure most could be converted to DCC if that's what you wanted but you'd need to obtain specialist advice. If you're happy to keep them as is then there's nothing wrong with standard DC control but I have no experience of the best or most suitable controllers. There'll be someone on here able to give advice on that one. As for the construction, 6 inch above ground on scaffold planks covered with roofing felt sounds just fine to me. As Ian says, take a look at how others have gone about it, the goal is always the same - a firm and stable base. Just about everyone on here has a garden layout so you're in good company should you need any further help, inspiration, or motivation!

It feels like it's been quite a productive day. Apart from mowing the lawn which was well overdue, I've actually cracked on with the layout too. Here's what I've been up to. I decided to retain the droppers I had already soldered in place to the outer line and discard the blue ones I had started fixing to the inner circuit. For the inner circuit I have now added smaller dropper wires with a black coating. There still looks to be a lot of wires but I'm actually quite pleased with this and when the tracks are ballasted it'll be hardly noticeable. Don't worry about the gaps and irregular spacing of the sleepers, they move about easily at the moment but it will all be sorted just before ballast is applied. Each section of track is now wired directly to the bus wires and although the photo may appear to show an abundance of wires to the tracks you'll notice that the lower 2 pairs straddle a rail join so the following rail join requires no wires at all. I've also made a start on ballasting using Gaugemaster ballast. I ordered both medium and fine grades in order to choose which was most suitable but I thought the medium was just a bit too large and the fine a bit too small so in order not to have any wastage I mixed the two grades together. I have completed one section of rail using Astonish floor polish as a fixative and will see how it comes out. I must add that the floor polish flows very easily indeed. The moment you drop a spot onto the ballast it immediately soaks in and the more drops you add you can actually see the polish flowing through ballast in adjacent sleepers. No need for any drops of washing up liquid with this stuff! The ballast is remarkably similar in size and colour to the stone particles embedded in the roofing felt. In the photo below, the wooden sleeper track has been ballasted on all but the outer sleeper edge while the concrete sleeper track has had ballast added only between the rails and will be finished later. I've also had a loco running backwards and forwards on each line today in order to test everything out. Apart from 37417 there's also been 57604 Pendennis Castle and so here's a couple of photos of her. Both photos show Pendennis Castle standing on the previously ballasted length of track but on the second of the 2 photos notice how, just in front of the loco, light can shine beneath the rails now that the plastic webbing between the sleepers has been removed. I really like that effect.

Well I've got some of that so thanks for the encouragement Ian. I would have been distraught after chopping and fiddling with all those sleepers to learn that ballasting was a no go. I really need the ballast now to hold all the sleepers firmly in place. Do you ever run a finger along the sleepers like you'd do with the keys on a piano? Well I do and after spending an age carefully aligning the chopped sleepers into something resembling scale distance apart, to forget yourself for one moment and suddenly run a finger along them is extremely annoying to say the least. Oh yes, I've done it. So I'm thinking floor polish as the ballast fixative which appears to be the easier to apply but I do also think that exterior varnish would prove a success. I would guess that the varnish may need thinning slightly prior to application but it's certainly worthy of some testing.

Very pleased for you George - it's really great to see something running for the first time and to know that we've shared most of the build with you (or at least you've shared it with us). An innovative attempt (to me at least) to lessen the gradient. I would never have thought of doing anything like that but yes, I reckon it might work. Keep us informed of progress with that one. In light of the choice of loco for the inaugural run, what are your particular interests in region, era etc..?

Did I really say that...!

The photos are fine Tom and I agree with Griff, that bridge really doesn't look out of place. Sorry to hear about the laptop - hopefully you'll be back in business again soon.

Looking good George - how have you got on today? Has there been any movements (as in Locomotives...!) ?

I've managed to complete the easing of the gap between sleepers on the final length of track so that's one task out of the way for tomorrow. I mentioned earlier that I've made an attempt to introduce some cant on the outside line of the curve ahead of the viaduct using some left over rubber pond liner. The liner has a thickness of 1mm and has proved to be just the right size for my needs. The liner was cut into narrow strips with a stanley knife and placed beneath the track just inside the outer edge of the sleepers. Here's a couple of photos showing how a loco looks on the curve now. That's as much 'cant' as I need. I want to get the inner line wired tomorrow and then do the same with the rubber liner. I can then begin tidying the whole thing up and contemplating ballasting. And yes, I've got that flower border seen in the photos to dig over. I hear you Iain but I've set my heart on ballasted tracks for the most visible sections and I've just got to give it a go. You're welcome to remind me of your advice should I fail miserably.

That's exactly what I was going to do in the first place! I'm undecided whether to replace the existing droppers or just leave them as they are. I've convinced myself that they're not too prominent and with a bit of weathering they should all but fade into the scenery but would I regret not ripping them out later? I'm going to sleep on this one. I've got one remaining length of concrete sleepered track to alter and then all the track that's currently laid will have had the sleepers eased outwards. I've made my finger ends sore sliding the sleepers along. I think I've cut and moved approx 2,000 sleepers over the past couple of days but I feel better for having done so. Now it's time to get things moving.

Hmmmh...that's what I was hoping to hear before I started adding the wiring. I've got a stash of 7 strand 0.2mm that I could have used and it would have been much less prominent which is why I asked the question in the Electrics and Wiring section. Now do I leave things as they are or do I start afresh with the droppers? I'd better go back outside and have a look and think about it. Just been adding some packing in the form of narrow strips of unused rubber pond liner around the curve section to give that bit of 'cant'. Looks okay, but now what about the wiring.....

Before I make a start today I've just been out and taken a couple of pics of how the wiring looks right now. This first image is looking along the layout with the bus wires seen running down each side of the track base. And this is a closer view of the soldered connections to the track and bus wire with just the one remaining 'brown' feed to be attached and the blue awaiting connection to the rail once the concrete sleepers have been eased out similar to the wooden ones.

Having just opened my early morning delivery I must say that the Gaugemaster ballast is much heavier than the Woodland Scenics and would seem to be the better, more resilient choice for outdoor use. I just need something to fix it in place now. Might have to go shopping.

Don't spoil the surprise! Bradley would be a worthy winner agreed.

Can there be a more ideal setting for a get-together? I think one or two members have raised the possibility of 'open days' or visits in the past but I'm not aware of any such events having taken place. As you point out, we are somewhat widely distributed around the country and beyond (I'm looking forward to an invitation from Roy!) so I would expect any such days so agreed to be somewhat 'quiet' affairs. Off hand I don't recall where each of us resides (well, I know where I live of course) but yes, if anyone is interested then there's no reason why we can't have days where we invite other members to visit. Personally I would like to have an operational layout before extending any offers!

Don't worry about it Roy. I wasn't involved with any forum and had no knowledge of anyone who had a garden layout when I started building the Selby Garden Railway. I used to buy the odd model railway magazine but rarely were any garden layouts, especially in OO gauge, featured. I began adding details of my construction to one or two 'other' forums but never felt at home with any like-minded people. That's why I decided to go it alone and post details of the construction to my own website and forum instead. It was the best move I've ever done. Now I'm among a group of people with much the same interest and as a group we applaud and encourage everyone's efforts on here without discrimination. Sure, there are differing levels of abilities involved with a garden railway too and some of the layouts featured on the forum really do stand out as being to a very high standard but I've found that those more talented members have always been all too ready to help and encourage the rest of us. I feel at home here and I never feel ashamed to share my 'handiwork' with everyone - I hope that everyone else feels likewise.